M4A3 Revisited

[Rubicon Models]

We are looking at our current M4A3 Sherman, and is reviewing the possibility (somehow) to value-add extra variants to it... plus fixing some of the issues on the existing sprue!

There are several possibilities:
- M4A3E2 Jumbo
- M36B1

What else is there?

Please note, this is not a definitely project, just some brainwashing!

[ripley]

Tank Recovery Vehicle M32B3 based on M4A3 - would need dummy turret , A- frame crane , tow bars etc , probably too much work . But a sand bag add on armor set or the deep wading trucking used on D Day might be a lower piece count add on

[Pinky]

But a sand bag add on armor set or the deep wading trucking used on D Day might be a lower piece count add on

Rubicon's M3A3 is a late version - they didn't come ashore on D-Day.  A sandbar armour set would be nice, but would need a lot of parts to do properly.

My vote would be for the Jumbo.  That would require a new turret, additional armour for the hull sides and glacis, and tracks with extended end connectors (all Jumbos had them).  Again, quite a lot of parts.

The issues with the current M3A3 could be fixed by replacing the turret bustle underside piece, making the bustle more rounder, replacing the mantlet with a larger one, and re-doing the cupola (mostly the hatch).  If you were going all the way, you'd also fix the exhaust vent and provide a chunkier .50 cal.

Approaching it from another direction, what if you provided optional parts to build a late M4A2?  They were used by the Marines and the Soviets.  It would only require an alternative hull (or, if you re-did the hull with a separate engine deck, optional engine decks), and optional rear hulls.  Everything else (including the 76mm turret) would be usable for both the M4A2 and the M4A3. 

[ripley]

Are you   sure about none ashore on D-Day ? The Large Hatch 75mm M4A3 was manufactured by Fisher starting in Feb 44 , the LH  76mm by Chrysler in Mar 44 . Some should have come ashore during the invasion  . Most pictures  in the older books I have are rather vague as to type of Sherman on the beaches ( not to mention even correctly identifying the beach  ) , never mind having  great black and white photos  so identifying features can be spotted  .

[Pinky]

Are you   sure about none ashore on D-Day ? The Large Hatch 75mm M4A3 was manufactured by Fisher starting in Feb 44 , the LH  76mm by Chrysler in Mar 44 . Some should have come ashore during the invasion  . Most pictures  in the older books I have are rather vague as to type of Sherman on the beaches ( not to mention even correctly identifying the beach  ) , never mind having  great black and white photos  so identifying features can be spotted  .

The tanks that went ashore with wading trunks on D-Day were M4s.  In fact, virtually all of the tanks used by the US Army in the Normandy fighting were (mid-production) M4s and M4A1s.  The 'large hatch' hull first appeared in service on M4 105mm-armed tanks, and these were around in June 1944.  M4A3s didn't begin to replace the other types in US service until August 1944.  The later M4A3W (i.e. the 'large hatch' type) didn't appear until around September/October 1944.  It took several months for tanks to get from the production lines in the US to the battlefield in Europe. 

[sandsmodels]

sandbags are already available for the m4a3 75mm:-

[Pinky]

These look very nice.  Who makes them?

[elias.tibbs]

S&S models http://sandsmodelsshop.com/product-category/28mm-160th-ww2/

[sandsmodels]

thanks spinfire,
got a load of 1/56th conversions planned

[elias.tibbs]

Anytime Shaun ^_^

So would this theoretical kit be a replacement for the existing? Or an additional kit with more options like the pioneer half track? Or both?

The only thing I could think of that could be added are things like the crab flail or dozer blade, but I think they were more commonly fitted to the A1? Or the waders, but I think they were more commonly fitted to the A2

[sandsmodels]

spinfire
all of our planned conversions would be just simple add on kits.
we already make the m1 dozer blade and this can be fitted to any m3 or m4.
the british however said the m4 and m4a1 were useless as tank dozers due to the aircraft sourced engine, while the m4a2 diesels were preferred by one unit and the next liked the multi engine m4a4?
I think crab flail is a very good idea, will look into it.
here is the m1 dozer test fitted to a jtfm m4a4.

and on it's own:-

I am sure it would fit the rubicon m4a3 just as well.
hope that helps
shaun

[DerKobra]

Tank Recovery Vehicle M32B3 based on M4A3 - would need dummy turret , A- frame crane , tow bars etc , probably too much work . But a sand bag add on armor set or the deep wading trucking used on D Day might be a lower piece count add on

Great ideas! The Jumbo would be greatly appreciated. The Deep Wading kit would be useful on the M4 or M4A1; not the M4A3. These were not present on the D-Day Landings.

Still waiting for the M4A1...

[ripley]

Nice . But its a M4A5 Grizzly, check out the 17 tooth sprocket ( Sherman had 13 ) and the Canadian dry-pin track ( CDP ) . Easy mistake as the cast body is based on the M4A1 but with thicker cast hull ( 75mm vs 51mm on the Sherman ) . Only about 180 M4A5s made and were used a training vehicles so most came through the war intact   . In fact a few show up in The Band of Brothers episode when Bull gets trapped in the drainage ditch .

[DerKobra]

Nice . But its a M4A5 Grizzly, check out the 17 tooth sprocket ( Sherman had 13 ) and the Canadian dry-pin track ( CDP ) . Easy mistake as the cast body is based on the M4A1 but with thicker cast hull ( 75mm vs 51mm on the Sherman ) . Only about 180 M4A5s made and were used a training vehicles so most came through the war intact   . In fact a few show up in The Band of Brothers episode when Bull gets trapped in the drainage ditch .

I stand corrected. Here's what I want:

[DerKobra]

Or