King Tiger - Assembly Video 201106

[Tracks]

That it probably doesn't have molded on Zim is a definite plus - though a transfer set (such as you can get for 1/35 or 1/48) could provide it if you wanted it.

Not having molded on zimmerit is a big thumbs up from me!
I always disliked the molded on zimmerit for several reasons:
1) You are stuck with it. Impossible to remove it if molded on. You have no choice.
2) Zimmerit was applied on in different ways. Molded on zim is all the same!
3) Not all vehicles would get zimmerit, but if molded on, well, you do not get that option.
4) They stopped applying zimmerit, but if molded on, well again you do not get that option.
5) Sometimes the molded on zimmerit just doesn't look right for one reason or another.
and the biggest reason is
6) There are so many different ways to add zimmerit to a model, but its impossible to remove if already molded on! So not having molded on zim gives the gamer/modeler a choice to have it or not. Espeically if there is a zimmerit transfer or add-on set (like what you can get for 1/35 or 1/48 models).

[Rubicon Models]

Proposed Features:

• Comes with both “Porsche” and “Production” turret
  - might include production turret only, depending on the number of sprues and sprue space

• Comes with or without Zimmerit
  - might not include Zimmerit version, depending on the number of sprues and sprue space

• Hand craft Zimmerit pattern, not stamped
  - if include Zimmerit version, the pattern will be handcrafted, not digital stamped

• Overlapping, non-interleaved steel-rim roadwheels
  - highly detailed wheels

• Highly detailed all-round track links
  - will be full-detail multi-part track links all round

• With or without side skirts

• All hatches can be open or closed

• Might include photo-etched parts

• Tank crew included
  - commander and driver, might include a full crew



Comments welcome.  Enjoy!

[Pinky]

I like moulded-on Zimmerit because I suck at doing it myself...

I think in the case of  Tiger II, it's better without.  Zimmerit was discontinued during its production run, and by the time the Henschel turret version was in widespread service most of them didn't have it.  On the other hand, it is virtually mandatory for the Porsche turret version.

Rubicon is obviously thinking about making this a premier kit - I had expected an engine to be included as well.  It's a fitting subject as a model, but far less useful to wargamers.  And it's a rather obvious choice.

Can I suggest a more radical option for a premier kit?  How about something from the early post-war period, like a Centurion?  I have been wondering if there is a market for the tanks of the 50s and 60s, like the Centurion, T-54/55 and M48, even though the scope for using them for gaming seems limited.  These vehicles saw extensive service in several wars, and were upgraded and modified in all sorts of ways.  If there is a market for display models in this scale, then it's worth considering branching out into the post-war period.  What do people here think?     

[Rubicon Models]

Rubicon is obviously thinking about making this a premier kit - I had expected an engine to be included as well.  It's a fitting subject as a model, but far less useful to wargamers.  And it's a rather obvious choice.

A premier kit... interesting!   

[Ballardian]

 I agree with Pinky that the 'Premier kit' idea is interesting, if, as you've stated, that the Tiger B will have all the things you mentioned, (all hatches open/closed, multi-part tracks - really curious about that one, are we talking length & link or something else - I'd imagine the resin type you're producing for other vehicles would be easiest, & they do look great, photo-etch - an excellent, if fiddly way of getting the mesh grills over the air intakes etc).
 I do think that the Tiger B is one those iconic vehicles (who's reputation far outstrips it's actual impact or usefulness), but I'm also with Pinky in that those early cold war vehicles can be equally 'iconic' - The Centurion, the JSIII & T-54/55 and the M26/46/47/48 do deserve some love. They do have a potential use for the Weird War/ Korea/Cold War gone hot type game (after all Warlord is introducing a Korea version of Bolt Action).

Edit: Whoops! Apologies, I hadn't realised that I'd put all that in bold - looks a bit shouty

[H0ffmn]

I like the idea of branching out and making post - war armor kits. Besides Centurions, T-55's and M-48's , I 'd like to the the following generation of armor vehicles, Chieftains , T-62's , and M60's as well, along with a T-72.Those vehicles are rare in resin, maybe there's a reason for that??

[ultravanillasmurf]

I like the idea of branching out and making post - war armor kits. Besides Centurions, T-55's and M-48's , I 'd like to the the following generation of armor vehicles, Chieftains , T-62's , and M60's as well, along with a T-72.Those vehicles are rare in resin, maybe there's a reason for that??

The problem there is you encounter "the Great Scale Shift". Most (based on available kits and posts in Lead Adventures Cold War sub forum) players use 1/48 -1/50 scale rather than 1/56.

Stuff in 1/56 for Korea will be welcomed, after that it will tend to look small.

Saying that, 1/48 scale Sherman M4A3(E8) and T34/85 would be great - but in the case of the former would be in direct competition with Taimya.

[ultravanillasmurf]

@Pinky Weirdly the examples at Bovington are the other way round (at least they were back when I visited).
Production turret

Prototype turret.

On the Tank Chats the Prototype turret one was in plain yellow.

According to the Osprey NVG, Zimmerit was discontinued in September 1944, so any encountered before (D-Day etc) then should have it  After that, probably not so much. As Pinky says, Prototype turrets should probably have it (they should have finished using up the prototype turrets by then).

The minimum kit should be non Zimmerit, production turret with optional  exhaust cowls (missing from your illustration).  This fills in a missing kit in the big cat pantheon. That is a guaranteed seller. Bonus points for a prototype turret (and drop in turret ring with armour) so the more artistic amongst us can zimmerit to their hearts content.

To do the prototype turret would require the zimmerit hull, in which case a zimmerit production turret would be a bonus. I wonder if you could do a top hull with two sets of  overlays for the two sides, front (upper and lower) and engine rear. You would probably need to to get good Zimmerit effect (see the sides on the Warlord one). The alternative is the printed resin decals. This would mean you could have separate tow cables etc.

Another alternative is to do the Zimmerit hull and prototype turret/production in resin and use the plastic chassis (similar to your planned M4 based ARV). You could reuse the turret bases from the plastic kit.

[ultravanillasmurf]

With respect to side skirts, please can they be easy to split into bits, many photographs show partial skirting.

As a resin option, the narrow transport tracks.

Ever contemplated moving into railway wagons in 1/56?

[Ballardian]

 UVS - The Bovvy Tiger B with the 'Porsche' turret was always intended to be a test vehicle & never saw service, which explains why it never recieved a coat of Zimmerit, while the production version was one of the earliest 'Henschel' turreted examples & so did.  They repainted it (and the Jadgtiger - also a test vehicle with the unusual Porsche suspension) in straight Dunkelgelb a few years ago, in order to be ready for their Tiger room exhibition - a more accurate representation of what the vehicles had when taken from Paderborn (I think).
 Here's what they look like now:

[ripley]

IRC about 400 Tiger II built . First 50 had Porsche turret ( some with message hatch and pistol ports )  Of the 50 , 47 covered in zimm , other 3 ( including Bov"s which I believe is tank #3 , were without zimm , and used for training and  experimentation . #2 with different exhaust layout  ended up in Switzerland { or Sweden } and used as range target in 1950s ) of the about 350 left  , half had zimm , the  later production vehicles ( 18 tooth drive sprocket , single link track , three rows of spare track on turret , etc ) didn't . I wouldn't mind a late version , no zimm with transport tracks option , the early versions are pretty much covered by the BA kit

[Rubicon Models]

...production turret with optional exhaust cowls (missing from your illustration).

UVS, can you upload an image or illustration of this?  Don't seem we have references... thanks!!

[ripley]

I thought it was the early Porsche turreted  type ( with schnorkal )  that had the straight Tiger I pipes and sheet metal covers . Will check my reference photos when I get home from work

[ultravanillasmurf]

...production turret with optional exhaust cowls (missing from your illustration).

UVS, can you upload an image or illustration of this?  Don't seem we have references... thanks!!

I thought it was the early Porsche turreted  type ( with schnorkal )  that had the straight Tiger I pipes and sheet metal covers . Will check my reference photos when I get home from work

Good point.

I do not have access to the book at the moment, I think it was the Images of War book  on the Tigers I and II, and Ripley will probably be right. There should be a mods list in the Osprey  NVG book, but besides September 1944, nothing has lodged in my mind.

[ultravanillasmurf]

 UVS - The Bovvy Tiger B with the 'Porsche' turret was always intended to be a test vehicle & never saw service, which explains why it never recieved a coat of Zimmerit, while the production version was one of the earliest 'Henschel' turreted examples & so did.  They repainted it (and the Jadgtiger - also a test vehicle with the unusual Porsche suspension) in straight Dunkelgelb a few years ago, in order to be ready for their Tiger room exhibition - a more accurate representation of what the vehicles had when taken from Paderborn (I think).
 Here's what they look like now:

That explains it.

I had not spotted the strange suspension on the JagdTiger.
https://www.tankmuseum.org/museum-online/vehicles/object-e1952-34
"Panzergruppe Paderborn" is an interesting "what if" unit.

"After the war Sennelager became part of the British Zone of Occupation. Both the Jagdtiger and the Pre-production King Tiger now in the Tank Museum were seen at Haustenbeck by British Ministry of Supply Researchers on the 25th August 1945. "

https://tankmuseum.org/museum-online/vehicles/object-e1994-81

Their search system has issues. I can find their production Tiger II but not the one with the prototype turret.