Haunted by the past... M4 Sherman Revisited! - Updated 160302

[Rubicon Models]

Something of a "in search of excellence" attitude...



Just for sharing...
 

[Pinky]

Hmmm - you know how I feel about this one...

This is a good start towards rectifying the 76mm turret.  But there is quite a lot more needed to get it to the standard of accuracy of your current kits:

- It's still too square.  The actual turret was more rounded, and bulged out towards the lower sides.  From the top, the bustle was also more rounded.
- the bustle is too big.  The rear face of the bustle was noticeably narrower., and the underside sloped more sharply.
- the mantlet was also more rounded, and didn't slope forward as much.  It was also a bit bigger.
- the rear ventilator and mounting brackets for the .50 cal look right.
- the loader's hatch is probably right for an M4A3(76mm), which appeared later the the M4A1(76mm). 
- the commander's harsh is still wrong.  It was a shallow dome, and the hinge sat flat, not at the odd angle of this one.
- the .30 cal mount is rather odd; it should be a proper cradle, not the triangular shape on this.
- the aerial mounts are too big.  The right hand mount should be raised slightly.

[Rubicon Models]

Pinky, this is very much a stop and go project.  We have done a lot of research through printed publications and the internet.  The available information, at times, are very conflicting; but we are pretty sure we are on the right track!  We also compared our 3D drawings with existing scale model kits to double confirm our design as well.

Here is a good reference site: http://the.shadock.free.fr/sherman_minutia/index.html

As for your comments, we will look into them in length as we progress.

Thanks!

[Pinky]

That's a great site - I hadn't seen that before.  Lots of good info.  I don't agree about there being a lot of conflicting info - there are some grey areas, but it's pretty clear what the 76mm turret looked like - especially the later version.

Most of what's there supports my observations about Rubicon's 76mm turret - especially the proportions.  I can see a version of the commander's cupola which is closer to the Rubicon version, but it's still not accurate (look at the position of the hinges, for example).  Anyway, it's good to see you're working on this, as your M4A3 kit is otherwise still one of your best (in my view).   

[Rubicon Models]

There are definitely no argument about the shape or look of the 76mm turret.  We are quite aware of the issues we previously had.  The turret revision is something we are doing on a O&O (on and off) basis in between projects, so don't expect immediate results!  But it will eventually be there!!

[vogless]

How about an upgrade kit when it's ready? 76 Turrets only? Maybe 2 per box?

[ultravanillasmurf]

How about an upgrade kit when it's ready? 76 Turrets only? Maybe 2 per box?

Or an M4A3 with HVSS and both turrets styles complete with all bits - similar to the T34/85 with spare T34/76 turret. I would assume the existing moulds would be replaced with one of the new turrets when economical.

I am not sufficiently knowledgeable about M4s to know if an M4A3E8 option would be compatible with an HVSS M4A3.

[Pinky]

Or an M4A3 with HVSS and both turrets styles complete with all bits - similar to the T34/85 with spare T34/76 turret. I would assume the existing moulds would be replaced with one of the new turrets when economical.

I am not sufficiently knowledgeable about M4s to know if an M4A3E8 option would be compatible with an HVSS M4A3.

'M4A3E8' is the designation of the M4A3 with HVSS.  This version had the late 76mm turret.  I think it would be a nice kit.  Not many options though, and Rubicon likes to provide plenty of options.

[Rubicon Models]

'M4A3E8' is the designation of the M4A3 with HVSS.  This version had the late 76mm turret.  I think it would be a nice kit.  Not many options though, and Rubicon likes to provide plenty of options.

There are times we will release kits without options to make them most cost effective!

[ultravanillasmurf]

'M4A3E8' is the designation of the M4A3 with HVSS.  This version had the late 76mm turret.  I think it would be a nice kit.  Not many options though, and Rubicon likes to provide plenty of options.

See above ^____^.

I was probably thinking of the E2, they apparently also had HVSS but late to post war: edit: or not, check link in detail.

link

Edit: Pinky is correct, (see below), some E2 hulls were used with HVSS but as prototype flame throwers.

[Pinky]

I was probably thinking of the E2, they apparently also had HVSS but late to post war:

Apparently not.  According to Hunnicutt's book on the Sherman, an HVSS version was planned in 1945, but it never went ahead because the M26 was in service.

I'd love to see either an M4A3E8 or an M4A3E2 from Rubicon.  I think Warlord is doing them both in resin, however a plastic kit from Rubicon would be far superior.  Of the two, I think the M4A3E2 might be the more popular with wargamers.  I don't think it would be practical to provide them both in one kit, unfortunately.

[stevepalffy]

M4A3E8....would be awsome !

[vogless]

So,

Will we be able to buy a 76 turret upgrade kit at some point?

[vogless]

Possibly?

[vogless]

Maybe?