Author Topic: M4 Sherman - More M4 Hybrid Images 170406  (Read 1463 times)

Pinky

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Re: M4 Sherman - Firefly IC 170125
« Reply #15 on: January 25, 2017, 10:16:45 AM »
Yes, I've been waiting for this one.  And it's lovely.  I think I'm going to throw my Warlord Fireflies into the bin and wait for this.

The inclusion of the tow bar is a nice touch.  As is the angled stowage box on the rear - I think I've seen at least one photo of one of these, but was it unit-specific?

Only one very minor point - I think this pattern of turret extension (i.e. the radio box) had a raised ridge along the rear panel, which was larger than the rest of the box (these extensions were quite crudely constructed).

UVS - I was looking at shape of the applique armour, and it looks as though many if not most M4s had that corner cut off.  It looks as though M4A2s didn't.  Which is odd, when you think of it, since the panel was supposed to protect the same point.

Great to see this kit in the works, Rubicon. 
« Last Edit: January 25, 2017, 11:02:01 AM by Pinky »

ultravanillasmurf

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Re: M4 Sherman - Firefly IC 170125
« Reply #16 on: January 25, 2017, 04:06:10 PM »
On the radio box, it is difficult to tell from the photographs on the minutia page.

http://the.shadock.free.fr//sherman_minutia/firefly_tank/index.html

One does show what Pinky describes.

I do not think I have anything suitable from the Tank Museum (must revisit).

The surviving Fireflies PDF apparently shows the rear plate slides in between the side plates rather than being a welded box. Period photographs are better source material.

Pinky

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Re: M4 Sherman - Firefly IC 170125
« Reply #17 on: January 25, 2017, 04:38:14 PM »
UVS - there are a lot of details in the Mark Hayward book on the Firefly.  I'll see if there's a clear image. 

Rubicon Models

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Re: M4 Sherman - Firefly IC 170125
« Reply #18 on: January 25, 2017, 04:42:42 PM »
Only one very minor point - I think this pattern of turret extension (i.e. the radio box) had a raised ridge along the rear panel, which was larger than the rest of the box (these extensions were quite crudely constructed).

The optional stowage bin had ledges that clings onto the radio box.   If we had that raised ridge, the stowage bin will not be able to fit properly.  We have bought a two-volume British Fireflies reference book from China (in Chinese of course, and probably a compilation of several English language books), which had hundreds of B/W Fireflies photos.  Most of them had both boxes, thus the decision.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2017, 04:44:30 PM by Rubicon Models »

Pinky

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Re: M4 Sherman - Firefly IC 170125
« Reply #19 on: January 25, 2017, 05:09:59 PM »
Rubicon - understood, but I think it's a vertical ridge, which wouldn't affect the attachment of the stowage box.  It's only a minor point, of course.

Pinky

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Re: M4 Sherman - Firefly IC 170125
« Reply #20 on: January 25, 2017, 10:04:38 PM »
Some close-ups of the same pattern radio box as appears on the Rubicon prototype.  Note that there are no boltheads, and the sides protrude past the rear plate.  It also seems a bit less tall than the one on Rubicon's prototype, although it's hard to tell.







« Last Edit: January 26, 2017, 12:13:35 AM by Pinky »

ripley

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Re: M4 Sherman - Firefly IC 170125
« Reply #21 on: January 25, 2017, 11:06:21 PM »
Hard to find top view pictures . Seems to be 3 styles of top plate on the radio box . Flat panel , with 3 small squares on top , or 3 round pieces . ( access or what ?) Bolts seem to be counter sunk or visible , again different builder ?






Pinky

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Re: M4 Sherman - Firefly IC 170125
« Reply #22 on: January 25, 2017, 11:33:03 PM »
Hayward's book has several top views.  He says that the Ic normally had the pattern of radio box depicted on Rubicon's prototype, although some had a flat top like your third photo (he says this was the later pattern of radio box).  So Rubicon's prototype is accurate, subject to some small details (such as the protruding bolts).  The circular panels seem to have been for cooling (the radio was inserted through the top).  Your first photo shows the first Firefly conversion, btw.  The square pattern seems to have been common on the Vc - here is a close-up.


« Last Edit: January 26, 2017, 12:12:40 AM by Pinky »

ultravanillasmurf

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Re: M4 Sherman - Firefly IC 170125
« Reply #23 on: January 26, 2017, 12:36:57 AM »
Nice pictures.

The one with the socks drying on the barrel has a long tool box on the side deck, I knew I got the idea from a photograph from somewhere, it occurs in British Tanks in Normandy amongst other places.

ripley

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Re: M4 Sherman - Firefly IC 170125
« Reply #24 on: January 26, 2017, 12:39:17 AM »
Wonder how it cooled the radio as they sit flush not vented  ? Maybe thinner metal let out the heat better than the 1 inch ( ? ) top plate ? What book by Hayward is being reffered to ? Maybe I need to get it  ;D  Checked out the book , ouch ! They want between $75 to $ 225 bucks depending where you look  for a 15  year old book . Hmm , I guess I'll give it a pas for now
« Last Edit: January 26, 2017, 09:32:08 AM by ripley »

Pinky

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Re: M4 Sherman - Firefly IC 170125
« Reply #25 on: January 26, 2017, 09:47:59 AM »
Ripley - that's a good question.  The panels in the top of the radio box don't seem to be any use for cooling, but apparently that's what they are for.  You couldn't remove the radio through the hole which was cut in the back of the turret (which was quite narrow), hence all of the radio box designs have a removable top panel.

Hayward's book is a genuine labour of love.  There's some speculation there, because the Firefly's history isn't as well documented as you'd expect, but he has collected a lot of great information and a lot of carefully chosen photos.  I should credit the photos above to this book.
« Last Edit: January 26, 2017, 09:50:41 AM by Pinky »

ripley

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Re: M4 Sherman - Firefly IC 170125
« Reply #26 on: January 26, 2017, 10:53:31 AM »
Must be a kind of heat sink thing . In the picture you posted above, pinky , they look to be less than 1/4 inch thick , a lot thinner than the top panel . Can't really see a need for them to have 2 or 3 bolts in them though . Funny how much weird  stuff we can find out about WW2 tanks as well as how much is still not known . Guess back then nobody thought about future hobbyists , just trying to stay alive was all that mattered . Looks like a great book , some really good reviews on various hobby sites , I'll have to add it to my list of must have books . You never know , sometimes you can find a real bargain on EBay . Then again , sometimes not ::)

Rubicon Models

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Re: M4 Sherman - M4 Hybrid Prototype 170405
« Reply #27 on: April 05, 2017, 10:23:57 PM »
Sneak preview of the M4 Hybrid (composite) prototypes - a US standard version
and a Sherman IC Hybrid. More to follow...



Enjoy!
;)

ultravanillasmurf

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Re: M4 Sherman - M4 Hybrid Prototype 170405
« Reply #28 on: April 05, 2017, 11:28:43 PM »
Very shiny! Looking forward to these.

Roll on the Sherman II.

ripley

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Re: M4 Sherman - M4 Hybrid Prototype 170405
« Reply #29 on: April 06, 2017, 08:21:56 AM »
Very nice . Firefly is going to look fantastic with your British crew figures sitting up on the turret

All I need now is a lot of 28mm Churchill track  ::)